diff --git a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create.py b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create.py
index 4d0d576ff..d26fc1b2e 100644
--- a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create.py
+++ b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create.py
@@ -20,7 +20,6 @@
 class UserCreate(
     EmailCheckMixin,
     CreateAction,
-    UserMixin,
     CreateUpdatePermissionsMixin,
     PasswordMixin,
     LimitOfUserMixin,
diff --git a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create_update_permissions_mixin.py b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create_update_permissions_mixin.py
index a51ca7769..b8791ff7a 100644
--- a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create_update_permissions_mixin.py
+++ b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/create_update_permissions_mixin.py
@@ -13,6 +13,7 @@
 from ....shared.mixins.user_scope_mixin import UserScope, UserScopeMixin
 from ....shared.patterns import fqid_from_collection_and_id
 from ...action import Action
+from .user_mixin import UserMixin
 
 
 class PermissionVarStore:
@@ -143,7 +144,7 @@ def _get_user_meetings_with_user_can_manage(
         return user_meetings
 
 
-class CreateUpdatePermissionsMixin(UserScopeMixin, Action):
+class CreateUpdatePermissionsMixin(UserMixin, UserScopeMixin, Action):
     field_rights: Dict[str, list] = {
         "A": [
             "title",
diff --git a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/update.py b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/update.py
index 609585287..9eb315cf0 100644
--- a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/update.py
+++ b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/update.py
@@ -21,7 +21,6 @@
 @register_action("user.update")
 class UserUpdate(
     EmailCheckMixin,
-    UserMixin,
     CreateUpdatePermissionsMixin,
     UpdateAction,
     LimitOfUserMixin,
diff --git a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/user_mixin.py b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/user_mixin.py
index e2df71f20..40419ab3f 100644
--- a/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/user_mixin.py
+++ b/openslides_backend/action/actions/user/user_mixin.py
@@ -83,6 +83,15 @@ class UserMixin(CheckForArchivedMeetingMixin):
         "group_ids": id_list_schema,
     }
 
+    def validate_instance(self, instance: Dict[str, Any]) -> None:
+        super().validate_instance(instance)
+        if "meeting_id" not in instance and any(
+            key in self.transfer_field_list for key in instance.keys()
+        ):
+            raise ActionException(
+                "Missing meeting_id in instance, because meeting related fields used"
+            )
+
     def update_instance(self, instance: Dict[str, Any]) -> Dict[str, Any]:
         instance = super().update_instance(instance)
         for field in ("username", "first_name", "last_name", "email"):
@@ -125,8 +134,6 @@ def meeting_user_set_data(self, instance: Dict[str, Any]) -> None:
                 meeting_user_data[field] = instance.pop(field)
         if meeting_user_data:
             self.apply_instance(instance)
-            if not meeting_id:
-                raise ActionException("Transfer data needs meeting_id.")
             meeting_user_data["meeting_id"] = meeting_id
             meeting_user_data["user_id"] = instance["id"]
             self.execute_other_action(MeetingUserSetData, [meeting_user_data])
diff --git a/openslides_backend/shared/mixins/user_scope_mixin.py b/openslides_backend/shared/mixins/user_scope_mixin.py
index 612319fb8..8dba158aa 100644
--- a/openslides_backend/shared/mixins/user_scope_mixin.py
+++ b/openslides_backend/shared/mixins/user_scope_mixin.py
@@ -42,14 +42,6 @@ def get_user_scope(
             if "group_ids" in id_or_instance:
                 if "meeting_id" in id_or_instance:
                     meetings.add(id_or_instance["meeting_id"])
-                else:
-                    meeting_user = self.datastore.get(
-                        fqid_from_collection_and_id(
-                            "meeting_user", id_or_instance["id"]
-                        ),
-                        ["meeting_id"],
-                    )
-                    meetings.add(meeting_user["meeting_id"])
             committees_manager.update(
                 set(id_or_instance.get("committee_management_ids", []))
             )
diff --git a/tests/system/action/user/test_create.py b/tests/system/action/user/test_create.py
index c0595cb76..76b731f4f 100644
--- a/tests/system/action/user/test_create.py
+++ b/tests/system/action/user/test_create.py
@@ -147,15 +147,27 @@ def test_create_comment(self) -> None:
         )
 
     def test_create_comment_without_meeting_id(self) -> None:
+        self.set_models(
+            {
+                "meeting/11": {
+                    "name": "meeting11",
+                    "committee_id": 79,
+                    "group_ids": [111],
+                    "is_active_in_organization_id": 1,
+                },
+                "group/111": {"meeting_id": 11},
+            }
+        )
+
         response = self.request(
             "user.create",
-            {
-                "username": "test Xcdfgee",
-                "comment": "blablabla",
-            },
+            {"username": "test Xcdfgee", "group_ids": [111]},
         )
         self.assert_status_code(response, 400)
-        assert "Transfer data needs meeting_id." in response.json["message"]
+        assert (
+            "Missing meeting_id in instance, because meeting related fields used"
+            in response.json["message"]
+        )
 
     def test_create_with_meeting_user_fields(self) -> None:
         self.set_models(