UPDI from Arduino programmer to the 3216 on 3.3V ?

[coderatchance]

Hello all,

the periphery connected to the 3216 requires 3.3V, indeed, the 3216 can handle even less , like 2.7V but the speed will be limited, however, although I can safely program via the 5V that is took from the Arduino as a programmer,
I am not able to program on 3.3V made on the level converter.

Although, the wiring is the same when switching to 3.3V, the error is pointing to the power... and the funny part is that is automatically showing 5V as Vtarget, which is obviously not :)
Any ideas what I am doing wrong?
Do I have to remove the resistor between the UPDI line and tiny in this case of programming?
In addition, is there anything else that I should be looking at?

Thank you in advance and I am looking forward for any questions , replies you may have!

Best.

avrdude: Version 6.3-20201216
         Copyright (c) 2000-2005 Brian Dean, http://www.bdmicro.com/
         Copyright (c) 2007-2014 Joerg Wunsch

         System wide configuration file is "/Users/imac/Library/Arduino15/packages/megaTinyCore/hardware/megaavr/2.6.4/avrdude.conf"
         User configuration file is "/Users/imac/.avrduderc"
         User configuration file does not exist or is not a regular file, skipping

         Using Port                    : /dev/cu.usbmodem14401
         Using Programmer              : jtag2updi
         Overriding Baud Rate          : 115200
JTAG ICE mkII sign-on message:
Communications protocol version: 1
M_MCU:
  boot-loader FW version:        1
  firmware version:              6.00
  hardware version:              1
S_MCU:
  boot-loader FW version:        1
  firmware version:              6.00
  hardware version:              1
Serial number:                   00:00:00:00:00:00
Device ID:                       JTAGICE mkII
         AVR Part                      : ATtiny3216
         Chip Erase delay              : 0 us
         PAGEL                         : P00
         BS2                           : P00
         RESET disposition             : dedicated
         RETRY pulse                   : SCK
         serial program mode           : yes
         parallel program mode         : yes
         Timeout                       : 0
         StabDelay                     : 0
         CmdexeDelay                   : 0
         SyncLoops                     : 0
         ByteDelay                     : 0
         PollIndex                     : 0
         PollValue                     : 0x00
         Memory Detail                 :

                                  Block Poll               Page                       Polled
           Memory Type Mode Delay Size  Indx Paged  Size   Size #Pages MinW  MaxW   ReadBack
           ----------- ---- ----- ----- ---- ------ ------ ---- ------ ----- ----- ---------
           signature      0     0     0    0 no          3    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           prodsig        0     0     0    0 no         61   61      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuses          0     0     0    0 no          9   10      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse0          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse1          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse2          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse4          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse5          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse6          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse7          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           fuse8          0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           lock           0     0     0    0 no          1    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           data           0     0     0    0 no          0    0      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           usersig        0     0     0    0 no         32   32      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           flash          0     0     0    0 no      32768  128      0     0     0 0x00 0x00
           eeprom         0     0     0    0 no        256   64      0     0     0 0x00 0x00

         Programmer Type : JTAGMKII_PDI
         Description     : JTAGv2 to UPDI bridge
         M_MCU hardware version: 1
         M_MCU firmware version: 6.00
         S_MCU hardware version: 1
         S_MCU firmware version: 6.00
         Serial number:          00:00:00:00:00:00
         Vtarget         : 5.0 V

avrdude: jtagmkII_initialize(): Cannot locate "flash" and "boot" memories in description
avrdude: AVR device initialized and ready to accept instructions

Reading | avrdude: jtagmkII_program_enable(): bad response to enter progmode command: RSP_NO_TARGET_POWER
avrdude: jtagmkII_program_enable(): bad response to enter progmode command: RSP_NO_TARGET_POWER
avrdude: jtagmkII_read_byte(): bad response to read memory command: RSP_NO_TARGET_POWER
avr_read(): error reading address 0x0000
    read operation not supported for memory "signature"
avrdude: error reading signature data for part "ATtiny3216", rc=-2
avrdude: error reading signature data, rc=-2
avrdude: jtagmkII_program_disable(): bad response to leave progmode command: RSP_NO_TARGET_POWER

avrdude done.  Thank you.

the selected serial port 
 does not exist or your board is not connected

[SpenceKonde]

I would not expect the UPDI signal on a tinyAVR to make it through most level shifters intact, especially with how high a baud rate the software serial runs at. The pin drivers on the UPDI pin are terribly weak because that's also the HV-override pin used to enter UPDI when the pin is not acting as UPDI. There;s always been one pin on each part that's like that - used for HV programming enable, and while it may be usable as GPIO. the output part is miserable. (reset pin on classics, UPDI/RESET pin here.... on the Dx-series they didn't even have the option turn UPDI pin into something else until the DD's, so there's no need for HV resets, but the pin can only be reset or an input - they gave up on pin drivers entirely aside from the pullup.) - of course, on classic AVR we didn't need to do bidirectional communication on those pins to program them, and here we do. Because of the high speeds and weak pin drivers, those magic transistor/resistor level shifters are not suitable. I don't think it would be able to get a low that was low enough for the serial adapter to detect.

[coderatchance]

Hello , I have the same problem, what level converter-chip would you suggest to use - Diodes? For example, does the "megaTinyCore" offers the so-called direction that can be used on the converters? If so, where on the host would be used?
In addition, has anyone tried the so-called automatic direction voltage converter ?

Actually, has anyone found a solution to this problem?
BTW have the same problem with the 406/806.

Best.

[SpenceKonde]

Uh, use a 3.3v board to program with? Or a 3.3v serial adapter wired for serial UPDI?