kmud-160219-iodine-supplement-reactions-hormones.vtt

WEBVTT

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 [Music]

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 Welcome to Ask Your Herb Doctor. My name is Andrew Murray. My name is Sarah

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 Johanneson Murray. We both trained in England and graduated there with a

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 degree in herbal medicine and clients consult with us regarding their health

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 issues and we recommend personalized advice in nutrition, supplements, herbs,

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 diet, lifestyle. We can be reached toll-free at 1-888-WBM-HERB or on the

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 web at www.westernbotanicalmedicine.com. So on tonight's show we're very welcome

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 again to have Dr. Raymond Peat joining us to give us the answers to his wisdom,

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 from his wisdom, explaining those things that perhaps not what we normally would

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 hear in the mainstream, almost certainly not what we would hear in the mainstream,

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 but nonetheless very well researched, plenty of information there that people

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 can also look at after the show either by visiting Dr. Peat's website at

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 www.raypeat.com. Plenty of articles fully referenced and like I said most of the

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 subjects there will have advice and research that you probably would not

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 have heard of elsewhere. So we're always very pleased to have Dr. Peat on the

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 show. Thanks for your time Dr. Peat. For people who perhaps have never heard you

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 or listened to the show, would you give people your background, your academic

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 and professional background before we get into the subject? After getting

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 a master's degree in humanities at University of Oregon, I came back in 1968

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 to 72 for a biology PhD concentrating on reproductive physiology. The

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 hormones involved in reproduction are involved in everything relating to life

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 and brain development was one of my second themes of research. So brain

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 development, aging and the hormones involved in that gradual decline

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 in good health. Okay so just for people that are listening to the show that we

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 will be taking calls from 7.30 till the end of the show either related to this

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 month's continuing topic of nitric

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 oxide. I wanted to get a little bit into the subject of iodine as an opener for

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 the show for people thinking about supplementing with iodine and also open

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 up a little bit about the Zika virus that's really catching media attention

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 here. I know there's certain, what do you want to say, authoritative reasons for it and

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 there are other supposedly conspiracy theories that we can call them

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 conspiracies but I think some of the merits of the conspiracies are worth

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 picking up and exploring. Anyway so if you live here in the area

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 the number is 1-800-KMUD-RAD or 923-3911. Again that 800 number, we do get

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 people from all over the States calling so that 800 number, let me just spell

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 that out for you, that's 1-800-568-3723. So Dr. Peat I was looking today and I

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 guess what's prompted it really is hearing the advice of people touting a

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 product called nascent iodine and I know that you specialize in thyroid hormone

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 and that iodine is definitely a key component of thyroid hormone and I think

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 we've always been led to believe that there has been an adequate supply of

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 iodine in the diet and then they produce iodized salt back in the 50s or 60s

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 perhaps earlier or not I'm not too sure but iodized salt has been around and

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 seafood also contains a lot of iodine in its own right so when I heard about this

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 product called nascent iodine they were saying that it was essentially not the

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 stable so stable ionic form and was more available was more readily taken up by

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 the thyroid gland and then I read some other articles about nascent iodine and

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 how reactive it was and I just wanted to feel you out what you what you know

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 about the thyroid's natural need for iodine whether or not we are deficient

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 and whether or not we need supplementation and if in fact this is

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 something actually that may not be necessary. In the 1980s I was looking

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 into the iodine nutrition question because I saw some women with breast

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 disease who recovered quickly when they took supplements of kelp or thyroid

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 hormone and the safest thing I think it is to correct the thyroid

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 problem directly rather than counting on big doses of iodine because the large

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 doses over many years for example there are about 70 or more publications

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 looking at iodine intake around the world over a period of decades and they

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 see that over half a milligram or even especially over one milligram of iodine

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 per day over a population is closely connected with increased risk of

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 thyroiditis and thyroid cancer. Wow, so it's aggravatory. One of the theories of

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 why that happens is that iodine spontaneously reacts or in the presence

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 of white blood cells their enzymes can cause iodine to react with fatty acids

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 that are unsaturated and if you've heard about the iodine number to describe the

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 degree of unsaturation of a fat for example the food oils that are highly

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 unsaturated have a high iodine number that means the number of molecules of

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 iodine that will be spontaneously absorbed by a certain quantity of the

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 oil because the iodine attacks the double bonds in the fat and where they

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 lack hydrogen saturation the iodine fills in analog saturated hydrogen

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 content so there is this tendency of unsaturated fats to react with iodine

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 and when that happens the body can interpret that as a signal to the

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 thyroid gland possibly imitating the thyroid stimulating hormone. Really? Wow.

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 So it doesn't cause an increase of thyroid hormone?

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 It can fill the site where thyroid stimulating hormone should be

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 acting and it can interfere with that so it probably can go either way forcing

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 too much activity or more likely blocking the effect of TSH. The

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 polyunsaturated fats by themselves interfere with the enzyme which releases

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 thyroid hormone from the gland so too much of the unsaturated fats with or

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 without iodine will have an anti thyroid effect but potentially the iodine

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 reaction could cause overstimulation by thyroid stimulating hormone or in its

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 place could imitate the action. But you mentioned the the binding the iodine

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 binding to the double bonds producing this product and in its own right that

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 could stimulate a inflammatory thyroiditis and/or a cancer? Yeah I think

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 that's why the the high iodine intake around the world statistically is

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 associated with greater risk of thyroid cancer and if there really were a

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 product that contained a more reactive form of iodine that would just mean that

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 it would attack more molecules but I looked up the source of that product of

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 one of the products started about 10 years ago and in Texas filed a patent

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 that is just completely goofy if you look at the diagram okay it shows

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 things that just can't happen right so it was filed 10 years ago and I think

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 it still hasn't been and probably never will be actually approved as a patent so

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 it you can apply for a patent on any goofy idea and then publish the

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 application and impress a lot of people. But maybe not bear the bring the product

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 to the market. So iodine supplementation is is very risky and basically you

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 should get your trace minerals from seafood sources rather than from

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 isolated iodine supplements and especially not in combination with any

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 kind of vegetable polyunsaturated oils? Yeah I think that's true. So just to

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 quickly wrap up this nascent iodine I think the reason that it caught my

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 attention was that the media spin on it was that because it didn't have a and in

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 chemistry people hearing this will understand what I'm saying but it's

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 probably I can go and elaborate it more simply perhaps but it doesn't have a

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 stable octet so it's out of electron shell isn't filled and they were saying

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 that because of this it was much more much more suitable in some way to

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 occupying these sites in the thyroid to produce thyroid hormone but it's very

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 reactivity is counterproductive because surely as soon as you if you could keep

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 it as unreactive as that in a bottle waiting to be ingested wouldn't it

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 surely and react with one of the first things that came into contact with when

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 you ingested it just to fill its octet and become stable again? Oh yeah the whole

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 idea of newly born or a nascent molecule when I was in junior high and high

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 school the chemistry people talked about nascent oxygen which for a few seconds

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 after it's formed in a certain way is highly reactive but that's because the

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 electrons are simply in an excited state like it had been sitting in in the

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 sunlight too long that's an electronic excitation which quickly passes as it

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 gives off a little bit of energy but in in certain short-term situations of a

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 few seconds that kind of excited electron state can make a molecule

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 useful for certain reactions but isn't something you'd want to put in your body

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 yeah okay so not for in vivo use but maybe in in vitro experimentations it

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 might have a some kind of a use. So it's basically a more dangerous form of

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 iodine that can cause a free radical reaction? Yeah that's what they're

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 talking about but I don't think it even exists in the product. Got it okay well

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 you're listening to AskUrbDr and Kami DeGalbaville 91.1 FM from 730

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 to the end of the show. Callers are invited to call in with any questions

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 about this month's wide topic here of things like obviously thyroid hormone is

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 going to interplay in a lot of it but the nascent iodine that we've just

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 brought up here and then the inflammatory reactions that happen

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 between estrogen and nitric oxide and what we can do what females as well as

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 males can do to offset their burden. Number here if you live in the area is

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 923 3911 if you want an 800 number for toll-free for across the states here

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 it's 1-800-568-3723 that translates as 1-800-KMUD-RAD. So Dr. Peat I was

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 looking at some abstracts here that we're going to form the show and the

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 first couple caught my attention just because they were based on isoflavones

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 and I know from our studying herbal medicine soy and isoflavones were all

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 the rage and were touted as being very health beneficial reducing cholesterol

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 and all this other ridiculously unscientific information that was

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 purported. So from the basis of soy they mentioned that there was

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 an alcohol soluble fraction that had been shown essentially to basically

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 cause female cancers that these things were taken up by the thyroid or they

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 probably inhibited the uptake of iodide from in by the thyroid by the gland and

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 that this increased the estradiol in females and that this was I know that

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 we've heard about soy and now I know we're definitely aware of soy being very

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 pro-carcinogenic because it's a estrogen mimic. But what do you what do you think

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 about this whole industry push that was producing and probably still is

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 producing soy infant formula which is one of the main one of the main foods

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 that was generated from it. I think it has seriously harmed lots of kids by

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 partly the estrogenic effect. The oil itself has a pro-estrogen effect

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 anti-thyroid effect apart from the those little molecules the isoflavones. The

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 category of flavones or flavonoids it's very similar to the isoflavones. The

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 phenyl group or benzene group is just located slightly closer to the keto

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 oxygen in the isoflavones and that group seems to be the estrogenic group. The

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 other orientation of the benzene group makes it more likely to be anti

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 estrogenic and lots of fruits and vegetables contain the anti-estrogenic

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 forms of those but the estrogen industry as a background led to a lot of the

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 sales talk about the effects of soy chemicals. And of course is a hugely

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 cultivated GMO cultivated product with patents owned for its for its

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 propagation and its use. Again no doubt another spawned product from big

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 corporations who essentially want to own the product. But don't all legumes have

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 these a certain percentage of these isoflavones? Yeah. But just soy is

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 particularly high? No I think the main problem with soy besides it being

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 basically inedible I think the main problem is that it's almost all grown in

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 the genetically modified form that takes large amounts of toxic pesticides. Which

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 are estrogenic too right? Yeah. And again just for the guys out there I think it's

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 very important to make you aware that you know guys have estrogen. It's not

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 just a female dominated situation and soy consumption in males has also been

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 positively associated with things like gynecomastia which is another side

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 effect if you like of estrogen activity within males. The very same thing Dr. B

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 also isn't it with alcohol drinking alcohol excess excessively can produce

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 a symptom of male breasts so that's a estrogen type reaction. When I was a kid

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 just before the Second World War we knew some of the very poor immigrants to

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 California and there was one couple in which the wife got a job but the father

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 could nurse the baby because his estrogen had become so high for

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 malnutrition and at the end of the Second World War when soldiers got out

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 of the prison camps lots of them had breasts from the effects of prolonged

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 starvation. Are we talking lactation too? Well in the case of this man in

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 California the wife said pause milk ain't got much strength. Yeah they can

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 lactate if they have a baby nursing. Wow so there's enough positive

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 feedback in the physiological mechanism there inherently to to produce that. So I

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 guess the high estrogen then stimulated raised their prolactin? Yeah. And then

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 with the suckling it produced milk? Yeah. That is just absolutely

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 incredible. Okay so again just for people that are listening it just begs the

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 question again where things like soy and soy products all we ever hear we don't

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 have a television really or listen we don't have a TV at all but we don't

00:19:03.380 --> 00:19:07.580
 listen to either you know broadcasts from mainstream media but what I was

00:19:07.580 --> 00:19:10.660
 going to say was most people have a TV or they're listening to a regular radio

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 station getting the same spin put on things and the same sales pitch and so

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 I'm just find it hard to believe that for a long time the whole soy thing

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 could exist and it could do what it did when actually it's more like a waste

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 product and people really shouldn't be eating soy because it's so dangerous in

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 terms of its estrogenic effect on females and males and those estrogenic

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 effects are very pro-inflammatory. Dr. Peate you've pointed out many many

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 occasions and I'm currently on board with that same feeling that the the

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 irritation and the inflammation that estrogen promotes is nothing but a

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 dangerous process in the body. And also Dr. Peate how would you compare

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 estrogen levels with menopausal women and men? With the aging a man's

00:19:59.620 --> 00:20:06.780
 estrogen pretty steadily increases but if he has a heart attack it goes up

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 sharply or if he has a traumatic injury it goes up during the recovery time but

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 generally there's a trend upward in men and in women when the ovaries stop

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 cycling there up until about the age of 38 to 40 there is a an actual steady

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 increase in estrogen and when the ovaries stop cycling they stop suddenly

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 producing progesterone but they continue producing a considerable

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 amount of estrogen until the body can adjust it downward. So there are a

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 few years in the 40s or early 50s usually when estrogen is extremely

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 excessive relative to the anti-estrogen effect of progesterone but then again

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 after the ovaries have pretty much stopped functioning with the rest of

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 the body as the progesterone fails all of the other tissues begin the same way

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 that happens in men. All of a woman's tissues tend to start increasing their

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 production of estrogen so that after menopause the fatter a woman is the more

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 estrogen she's producing because the fat tissue is a good source of it but on any

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 tissue after menopause to the degree that it's stressed will begin producing

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 estrogen. So is it about the same level between men and women? Yeah. After the

00:22:02.140 --> 00:22:09.500
 menopausal period? I think women tend to be fatter in old age and so they are

00:22:09.500 --> 00:22:14.860
 more likely to have a higher level of estrogen but just measuring the blood

00:22:14.860 --> 00:22:24.460
 estrogen gives a misleading impression because when progesterone is

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 deficient the estrogen receptor as well as the aromatase enzyme that makes

00:22:31.940 --> 00:22:38.220
 estrogen the receptors bind it in cells and there's no progesterone to destroy

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 the estrogen receptor so it just stays in the cell and some of the enzymes that

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 are no longer inactivated by progesterone other enzymes capture

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 circulating estrogen that should have been excreted cause it to be deposited

00:23:00.140 --> 00:23:09.460
 in cells. Still other enzymes shift any estrogen away from the estrone form to

00:23:09.460 --> 00:23:16.700
 the estriol form which is the most active intense estrogen. So everything

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 that happens when progesterone is deficient tends to load up various cells

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 all through the body with more and more estrogenic stimulation even though it

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 isn't being released to be measured in the blood. Right so the blood test could

00:23:36.380 --> 00:23:41.260
 appear that it's fine but if you have a large amount of fat cells that could be

00:23:41.260 --> 00:23:45.460
 stored in that and other tissues and what about weight loss for women who are

00:23:45.460 --> 00:23:49.740
 in the menopause if they lose that weight do they then poison themselves

00:23:49.740 --> 00:23:55.020
 with estrogen as it comes out of the cells? Just temporarily but it's better

00:23:55.020 --> 00:24:01.900
 to get rid of it and have it local because inside the cells it produces

00:24:01.900 --> 00:24:10.500
 things such as breast cancer lung cancer uterine cancer ovarian cancer all of the

00:24:10.500 --> 00:24:17.020
 tissues that no longer have enough progesterone are subject to cancer. So

00:24:17.020 --> 00:24:21.540
 what about the women that continue to menstruate like I heard from this lady

00:24:21.540 --> 00:24:29.780
 the other day that she had a friend who was 17 was still menstruating. I talked

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 to a gynecologist who was giving his wife progesterone and she was still

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 menstruating at 60 and if you happen to have a very good system for producing

00:24:46.300 --> 00:24:52.300
 progesterone there's no reason why it shouldn't stop at 55. There's no reason

00:24:52.300 --> 00:24:57.540
 to stop at 55 then right? No. I mean basically would do you think it would be

00:24:57.540 --> 00:25:00.620
 beneficial that women continue to menstruate until the day they die? I

00:25:00.620 --> 00:25:12.820
 think so. Like the flamingos? Yeah flamingos have no life limitation

00:25:12.820 --> 00:25:21.820
 according to ordinary mortality curves. They seemed only died by accident.

00:25:21.820 --> 00:25:28.020
 Starvation right? Okay you're listening to Ask Your Doctor KMUD Galbraithville 91.1 FM

00:25:28.020 --> 00:25:31.940
 from 7.30 till the end of the show. Please call in with any questions you

00:25:31.940 --> 00:25:35.500
 have either related or unrelated to this month's subject. Number if you're in the

00:25:35.500 --> 00:25:42.060
 area area code 707 923 3911 or for those folks in different states across the US

00:25:42.060 --> 00:25:49.140
 has an 800 number which is 1-800-568-3723. Dr. Peat I wanted to pick up on a

00:25:49.140 --> 00:25:52.220
 point that you mentioned during your last discourse then I did I've not had

00:25:52.220 --> 00:25:56.700
 that before. Progesterone destroys the estrogen receptor. Does anything

00:25:56.700 --> 00:26:00.300
 similarly happen with estrogen doing the same thing to progesterone receptors or

00:26:00.300 --> 00:26:06.060
 is it just that way around? Well estrogen activates its own receptor in most

00:26:06.060 --> 00:26:16.060
 tissues and it will activate inflammatory things which tend to turn

00:26:16.060 --> 00:26:22.100
 off the progesterone receptor if you have an excess.

00:26:22.100 --> 00:26:33.300
 Generally the normal function would be for progesterone to rise as soon as the

00:26:33.300 --> 00:26:40.300
 estrogen has had its surge and then knock it out. The estrogen is fine if

00:26:40.300 --> 00:26:46.820
 it's active only for 12 to 24 hours every month. Right, right. It does its job and

00:26:46.820 --> 00:26:51.020
 then it's finished. But like you said the tissues will carry on producing estrogen

00:26:51.020 --> 00:26:57.260
 especially in obese individuals and menopause or even postmenopausal

00:26:57.260 --> 00:27:03.620
 women. Yeah Alexander Lipschutz showed that if you remove the ovaries and then

00:27:03.620 --> 00:27:11.860
 implant just a tiny estrogen releasing pellet just a very small but continuous

00:27:11.860 --> 00:27:19.620
 dose it's very carcinogenic. But if you interrupt that or even a large dose with

00:27:19.620 --> 00:27:26.100
 estrogen with progesterone periodically you don't get cancer. And in his

00:27:26.100 --> 00:27:34.660
 experiments the estrogen uninterrupted was carcinogenic to uterus, breast, lungs,

00:27:34.660 --> 00:27:41.700
 kidneys, brain and intestine. Yeah. Basically everything. Okay so just

00:27:41.700 --> 00:27:46.700
 another another call for all the ladies out there. There really is nothing I

00:27:46.700 --> 00:27:50.180
 know it's a personal thing but there's nothing wrong with continuing your

00:27:50.180 --> 00:27:54.020
 menstrual cycle as long as you possibly can. Progesterone is your friend,

00:27:54.020 --> 00:27:58.140
 estrogen is your enemy and the only thing really that estrogen is any good

00:27:58.140 --> 00:28:02.380
 for is the implantation. So I may have a first caller so let's get this first

00:28:02.380 --> 00:28:09.420
 caller on the air. Caller where are you from? I'm from Kansas City. Did you say Kansas City?

00:28:09.420 --> 00:28:18.020
 Yeah Kansas City. Oh hey welcome to the show. Thanks. Hi Dr. Peat. What do you think is

00:28:18.020 --> 00:28:22.580
 happening if someone experiences digested cramps and bloating within 30 minutes

00:28:22.580 --> 00:28:27.180
 when using vitamin E orally and which still occurs even when switching to a

00:28:27.180 --> 00:28:31.780
 few different products as well as even when using several drops of progeste

00:28:31.780 --> 00:28:41.660
 which also contains vitamin E? I think it's the viscous oily quality that is

00:28:41.660 --> 00:28:50.860
 irritating. Some people have that reaction for example if they try to

00:28:50.860 --> 00:28:57.300
 use it in their armpit where the skin is very sensitive the highly viscous oil

00:28:57.300 --> 00:29:04.620
 can be very irritating so I think it should be taken with food so that it

00:29:04.620 --> 00:29:10.500
 doesn't hit any of the membranes in the concentrated form. Do you think it's

00:29:10.500 --> 00:29:22.020
 possible to develop a soy allergy somewhere along the way? Yeah many people

00:29:22.020 --> 00:29:30.340
 do have soy allergies but the oil doesn't contain any of the proteins that

00:29:30.340 --> 00:29:40.100
 people are allergic to so I haven't heard of any documented allergy to oily

00:29:40.100 --> 00:29:48.060
 soy products such as soy oil. Okay do you think it's possible that for that person

00:29:48.060 --> 00:29:52.020
 that's something like 400 units international units of the

00:29:52.020 --> 00:29:57.220
 alpha-tocopherol with 300 milligrams of gamma, delta and beta-tocopherol is

00:29:57.220 --> 00:30:02.220
 excessive and possibly being excreted mostly in bile which is alkaline and

00:30:02.220 --> 00:30:06.220
 possibly irritating to an already irritated intestine which would maybe

00:30:06.220 --> 00:30:17.580
 cause the cramps and bloating? I doubt it because the effect of vitamin E on many

00:30:17.580 --> 00:30:24.740
 cell processes is anti-inflammatory for example it inhibits prostaglandin

00:30:24.740 --> 00:30:35.620
 formation similar to aspirin in its range of anti-inflammatory effects.

00:30:36.620 --> 00:30:40.780
 Okay that's great thank you. All right thank you for your call. We do have another call

00:30:40.780 --> 00:30:44.180
 on the air so let's take this next caller. Caller where are you from?

00:30:44.180 --> 00:30:49.580
 Hi I'm calling from Mexico. Mexico, the first caller from Mexico. Welcome to the

00:30:49.580 --> 00:30:56.460
 show what's your question? Thanks hi if I understood correctly earlier you were

00:30:56.460 --> 00:31:04.020
 talking about how taking extra iodine can interact with PUFA to cause problems

00:31:04.020 --> 00:31:12.460
 and I know someone who took a few milligrams of extra iodine and she went

00:31:12.460 --> 00:31:21.100
 into a some kind of thyroid hyperthyroid like crisis state where she couldn't

00:31:21.100 --> 00:31:27.420
 tolerate any physical exertion. Her muscles were really weak and her pulse

00:31:27.420 --> 00:31:35.540
 was very high and years later she still gets that reaction from thyroid and I

00:31:35.540 --> 00:31:44.860
 was wondering if that's related to iodine? Back in the years when many people

00:31:44.860 --> 00:31:56.180
 were in certain regions for example in southern Mexico, western China and Ohio

00:31:56.180 --> 00:32:03.860
 Eastern Europe those areas were very deficient in iodine and they would

00:32:03.860 --> 00:32:10.500
 develop an enlargement of the thyroid gland and then when they ate iodine even

00:32:10.500 --> 00:32:17.700
 a fairly normal amount suddenly their gland would start forming thyroid hormone

00:32:17.700 --> 00:32:27.300
 and if the goiter was very big they could have serious hyperthyroidism that

00:32:27.300 --> 00:32:33.700
 could last for years but if the gland was just slightly swollen it would pass

00:32:33.700 --> 00:32:42.060
 in about two months. So that's a that's a very real sequelae of using iodine in

00:32:42.060 --> 00:32:48.140
 that particular individual that they would have that increased thyroid

00:32:48.140 --> 00:32:51.700
 production that would be you know resulting in what the callers just

00:32:51.700 --> 00:32:57.380
 mentioned? Yeah if they took their iodine in the form of thyroid hormone they could

00:32:57.380 --> 00:33:05.340
 normalize their body functions and be replacing iodine in a limited

00:33:05.340 --> 00:33:09.820
 graded fashion so that they wouldn't go into those hyperthyroid states and

00:33:09.820 --> 00:33:16.340
 getting the required amount of hormone would cause their pituitary to settle

00:33:16.340 --> 00:33:22.300
 down and let the gland gradually shrink. Because that is treatment for goiter is

00:33:22.300 --> 00:33:28.300
 that you supplement with thyroid hormone? Yes to treat hyperthyroidism

00:33:28.300 --> 00:33:34.860
 the safest thing is to supplement usually with thyroid hormone. So again

00:33:34.860 --> 00:33:39.120
 just to just to expand on the very first question to Dr. Peate about the nascent

00:33:39.120 --> 00:33:44.140
 iodine it's not a good idea and also many other forms of iodine

00:33:44.140 --> 00:33:48.660
 supplementation is not necessary and if you need iodine and you have any kind of

00:33:48.660 --> 00:33:52.900
 low thyroid actually thyroid hormone is the best way to get bound iodine. Okay

00:33:52.900 --> 00:33:58.340
 did you have anything else you wanted to bring out caller? Well thanks a lot I was

00:33:58.340 --> 00:34:03.540
 just wondering if it you know if it would be a good idea to do anything

00:34:03.540 --> 00:34:10.740
 specific to try to rectify this this problem or if there's any tips on

00:34:10.740 --> 00:34:17.620
 tolerating thyroid does avoiding iodine help in a situation like that? The people

00:34:17.620 --> 00:34:25.500
 who have trouble with the actual thyroid hormone they can be either deficient in

00:34:25.500 --> 00:34:32.540
 magnesium because hypothyroidism makes all of your tissues fail to retain a

00:34:32.540 --> 00:34:38.020
 normal amount of magnesium and then when you supplement it suddenly you

00:34:38.020 --> 00:34:44.300
 experience an extreme magnesium deficiency in your heart for example and

00:34:44.300 --> 00:34:51.940
 your brain and so taking some magnesium at the same time as the thyroid it will

00:34:51.940 --> 00:34:59.380
 help those people. Others if they're deficient in adrenal or ovarian or

00:34:59.380 --> 00:35:08.220
 gonadal steroids will suffer stress symptoms when they take thyroid and and

00:35:08.220 --> 00:35:14.860
 so using a supplement such as pregnenolone will make them tolerate

00:35:14.860 --> 00:35:20.060
 adapting to the thyroid more easily. And what about Dr. Peat how some people if

00:35:20.060 --> 00:35:25.220
 they supplement with t4 thyroxine they will have those symptoms like our caller

00:35:25.220 --> 00:35:29.260
 mentioned where their muscles are weak and they their hearts pounding they're

00:35:29.260 --> 00:35:33.460
 pulses high and isn't that because if they're already low thyroid and they

00:35:33.460 --> 00:35:36.580
 take the t4 then they're actually stimulating the adrenaline because

00:35:36.580 --> 00:35:42.300
 they're not converting it? Yeah when when people have suffered for a long time

00:35:42.300 --> 00:35:48.940
 with low thyroid they're likely to have extremely high adrenaline and cortisol

00:35:48.940 --> 00:35:57.780
 levels and that causes them to turn t4 into reverse t3 blocking the actual

00:35:57.780 --> 00:36:05.700
 active t3 hormone and then if they accumulate more and more t4 that will

00:36:05.700 --> 00:36:13.220
 interfere competitively with a little bit of t3 that they do have so they can

00:36:13.220 --> 00:36:20.380
 exaggerate the state of their hypothyroidism if they're in that really

00:36:20.380 --> 00:36:26.460
 extreme stress state. Could you say that t4 perhaps is mainly only 10% as

00:36:26.460 --> 00:36:35.340
 active as the active t3 hormone? It really varies in the 1940s when they

00:36:35.340 --> 00:36:43.060
 first synthesized it they tested it on male medical students and it was exactly

00:36:43.060 --> 00:36:53.300
 as effective as armor natural thyroid but that's because young men 20 22 years

00:36:53.300 --> 00:37:02.060
 old have very good livers that can perfectly convert it but even at the

00:37:02.060 --> 00:37:08.860
 same age women are more likely to have problems with plain thyroxine. But when

00:37:08.860 --> 00:37:14.500
 they talk about t4 being weakly active how do you how do you interpret that or

00:37:14.500 --> 00:37:21.260
 how do you see t3 versus t4 in terms of orchestrating metabolic events?

00:37:21.260 --> 00:37:30.140
 The standard textbook idea is that t3 is four times more powerful than t4

00:37:30.140 --> 00:37:36.220
 but really if your liver is good you can get a hundred percent of the benefit out

00:37:36.220 --> 00:37:46.900
 of t4 and if you're a woman under stress with high estrogen your liver isn't

00:37:46.900 --> 00:37:53.780
 going to convert any of it to the right active hormone and the more you take I've

00:37:53.780 --> 00:38:01.740
 known of one woman was hospitalized and got more and more hypothyroid the higher

00:38:01.740 --> 00:38:06.740
 they raised her thyroxine dose and as soon as they gave her t3 became right

00:38:06.740 --> 00:38:13.420
 out of the myxedema coma but I've seen people in less extreme states who got

00:38:13.420 --> 00:38:18.500
 more and more depressed or psychotic or whatever when they increased their

00:38:18.500 --> 00:38:22.780
 thyroxine dose. Okay I have one more question for the caller do you know if

00:38:22.780 --> 00:38:28.140
 this lady you're speaking about was taking a t3 t4 combination supplement or

00:38:28.140 --> 00:38:33.060
 were they taking just t4 or just t3 are you aware of that? Well yeah originally

00:38:33.060 --> 00:38:38.540
 she was taking an armor supplement and when she took the supplemental iodine

00:38:38.540 --> 00:38:45.340
 that caused the problem and since then she has tried different t4 t3 combo

00:38:45.340 --> 00:38:52.020
 products as well as a couple different pure t3 supplements so I think it's

00:38:52.020 --> 00:38:56.860
 something to do with this adrenaline or sensitivity to adrenaline that Dr.

00:38:56.860 --> 00:39:02.700
 Peat was was talking about where if I understand it correctly the thyroid

00:39:02.700 --> 00:39:09.900
 sensitizes the tissues to the already high the already existing adrenaline. But

00:39:09.900 --> 00:39:13.340
 that should only last a couple days and then it should balance out. Well

00:39:13.340 --> 00:39:20.860
 sometimes it lasts for a couple of weeks if you're really extreme you have to use

00:39:20.860 --> 00:39:28.860
 little bits of supplements and be very careful about your intake of protein

00:39:28.860 --> 00:39:37.360
 sugar calcium everything that is counter to the stress. So when you're in a

00:39:37.360 --> 00:39:42.660
 situation like that she was using very small specks of t3 you know under one

00:39:42.660 --> 00:39:48.260
 microgram sometimes is this thing to do to hold that very low dose for a couple

00:39:48.260 --> 00:39:52.820
 weeks and then increase it in very very small increments as the adrenaline

00:39:52.820 --> 00:40:02.060
 hopefully comes down? Yeah I've known people who for a week or two would stay

00:40:02.060 --> 00:40:10.420
 with one microgram doses of t3 but you have to make sure your whole diet

00:40:10.420 --> 00:40:20.460
 is very good. Having hormone tests and a vitamin D blood test is helpful because

00:40:20.460 --> 00:40:27.500
 magnesium and calcium work together and vitamin D regulates them. Yeah and making

00:40:27.500 --> 00:40:31.100
 sure that she's getting plenty of carbohydrates like in the form of fruit

00:40:31.100 --> 00:40:35.980
 juices because that's like Dr. Peat saying make sure nutritionally she's

00:40:35.980 --> 00:40:40.180
 getting at least 75 grams of protein. I don't know the weight and nutritional

00:40:40.180 --> 00:40:48.740
 needs but at least 150 grams or more of sugars and good fats. Okay thanks very

00:40:48.740 --> 00:40:53.260
 much. All right thanks for sure. I think we have another caller there. Yeah okay we

00:40:53.260 --> 00:40:57.660
 have the next caller. Caller where are you from? Hi I'm calling from New York. Yeah

00:40:57.660 --> 00:41:02.700
 welcome to the show. What's your question? Hi I have a question for Dr. Peat about

00:41:02.700 --> 00:41:09.380
 Buteyko breathing and heart rate. Dr. Buteyko noted that as you progress with

00:41:09.380 --> 00:41:15.180
 retaining more and more co2 with the Buteyko breathing then the heart rate

00:41:15.180 --> 00:41:20.780
 will decrease and I wondered what you thought about that. I've noticed that in

00:41:20.780 --> 00:41:26.780
 my own practice that it does go down but the temperature is still good and I

00:41:26.780 --> 00:41:34.260
 wondered if the metabolism is still good when that happens or what you think

00:41:34.260 --> 00:41:39.740
 about it? Yeah there have been experiments with animals increasing

00:41:39.740 --> 00:41:47.020
 their co2 and watching what happens to the heart and blood vessels and co2

00:41:47.020 --> 00:41:54.020
 relaxes the blood vessels so it decreases peripheral resistance and that

00:41:54.020 --> 00:42:02.500
 makes the heart able to pump more blood more easily with less work. So it usually

00:42:02.500 --> 00:42:11.100
 means a bigger stroke volume. Okay so the decreased heart rate. Even though it's a

00:42:11.100 --> 00:42:18.620
 lower heart rate you think that that you can still get the same benefits as you

00:42:18.620 --> 00:42:23.180
 would if you weren't restricting your breathing but I mean I mean I know you

00:42:23.180 --> 00:42:27.260
 recommend a high heart rate typically for people that aren't practicing that

00:42:27.260 --> 00:42:35.020
 kind of breath control. Yeah but that's most people are running on

00:42:35.020 --> 00:42:42.180
 adrenaline. I've known people who one woman had had a hundred and eighty pulse

00:42:42.180 --> 00:42:48.700
 steadily for years another person had been around 130 resting pulse for a long

00:42:48.700 --> 00:42:54.860
 time. Both of these people within two weeks got down to a normal under a

00:42:54.860 --> 00:43:00.380
 hundred pulse rate when they supplemented thyroid and one of the

00:43:00.380 --> 00:43:06.500
 things the thyroid is doing is increasing your co2 decreasing the

00:43:06.500 --> 00:43:13.380
 lactic acid and the inflammation so that your capillaries open up you have less

00:43:13.380 --> 00:43:21.180
 peripheral resistance so your heart doesn't have to work so frantically. Okay

00:43:21.180 --> 00:43:25.980
 well thank you very much. Thanks dear call caller. Okay so for anybody else

00:43:25.980 --> 00:43:29.380
 listening here it's always good to get people from all over the state so we've

00:43:29.380 --> 00:43:33.180
 had Mexico so far we've had New York Midwest so let's keep it up there's an

00:43:33.180 --> 00:43:40.460
 800 number here it's 800 568 3723 we've got Dr. Ray Peat with us on the show and

00:43:40.460 --> 00:43:43.980
 he's sharing his wisdom so I guess until the phones ring again for the next time

00:43:43.980 --> 00:43:47.820
 I wanted to ask you we haven't actually got very far through with all the

00:43:47.820 --> 00:43:50.620
 questions I wanted to ask you at this point which is good news because people

00:43:50.620 --> 00:43:54.220
 have been calling but I may have to carry on this topic next month perhaps if

00:43:54.220 --> 00:43:58.060
 you're available. I saw the article there which again just highlights the

00:43:58.060 --> 00:44:02.420
 estrogenic problem that the benign and malignant thyroid nodules are far more

00:44:02.420 --> 00:44:08.100
 common in females than males no doubt a consequence of estradiol so given that

00:44:08.100 --> 00:44:14.060
 the mainstream lie is that estrogen is good for you and healthy and what can be

00:44:14.060 --> 00:44:17.700
 done do you think simply to offset the estrogen I know you've mentioned

00:44:17.700 --> 00:44:22.180
 progesterone which is probably the first thing that springs into my mind but in

00:44:22.180 --> 00:44:30.860
 terms of reducing a female's estrogenic burden. There were some studies of slices

00:44:30.860 --> 00:44:39.840
 of thyroid gland in vitro and they found that added estrogen caused the cells to

00:44:39.840 --> 00:44:47.340
 keep synthesizing hormone but and to keep growing but to fail to secrete any

00:44:47.340 --> 00:44:53.660
 of the hormone when they added progesterone it began secreting the

00:44:53.660 --> 00:45:03.360
 hormone and up until the last few decades women rather than just having

00:45:03.360 --> 00:45:09.480
 nodules in their thyroid they were the ones most susceptible to growing a

00:45:09.480 --> 00:45:19.080
 very large goiter that sometimes was as big as a cantaloupe and the nodules are

00:45:19.080 --> 00:45:28.760
 basically the same process of estrogen activating the cell division and

00:45:28.760 --> 00:45:38.920
 synthesis of colloid the material that the hormone later will be made from and

00:45:38.920 --> 00:45:47.680
 desensitizing the cells to the the hormone secreting effect of thyroid

00:45:47.680 --> 00:45:56.560
 stimulating hormone and progesterone by antagonizing estrogen will reverse those

00:45:56.560 --> 00:46:05.200
 processes but when you get the cells multiplying and making the protein you

00:46:05.200 --> 00:46:14.200
 will get at least a nodule maybe if it continues steadily the whole gland will

00:46:14.200 --> 00:46:18.120
 get bigger and bigger. Okay we do actually have another caller so let's

00:46:18.120 --> 00:46:21.560
 just hold that for right there and take this next caller so caller you're on the

00:46:21.560 --> 00:46:26.720
 air and where you from? How you doing I'm from right here in town. Okay a local

00:46:26.720 --> 00:46:32.160
 caller you're welcome what's your question? I was curious to know if this I

00:46:32.160 --> 00:46:39.160
 heard you talking about the vitamin D in the thyroid and the magnesium I'm just

00:46:39.160 --> 00:46:41.960
 wondering if that would have anything to do with what's called restless legs

00:46:41.960 --> 00:46:47.040
 syndrome. Yeah Dr. Peter that magnesium deficiency or how would you explain

00:46:47.040 --> 00:46:55.400
 restless legs syndrome? There has been quite a lot of research for example they

00:46:55.400 --> 00:47:02.440
 noticed that people taking SSRI antidepressants tended to have episodes

00:47:02.440 --> 00:47:10.360
 of restless legs and so they saw that nitric oxide and serotonin were

00:47:10.360 --> 00:47:18.240
 involved in producing it and those are produced largely from the intestine the

00:47:18.240 --> 00:47:24.760
 most intense problem of both serotonin and nitric oxide production is from an

00:47:24.760 --> 00:47:33.680
 irritated intestine and hypothyroid people over produce both nitric oxide

00:47:33.680 --> 00:47:41.560
 and serotonin typically and have sluggish digestive systems and often

00:47:41.560 --> 00:47:50.720
 have a tendency to generalized inflammation and the serotonin seems to

00:47:50.720 --> 00:47:58.520
 be specifically what pushes those motor nerves the cause of the leg jumpiness.

00:47:58.520 --> 00:48:04.040
 Does that help you out or explain things to you caller? Yeah yeah somewhat it does

00:48:04.040 --> 00:48:10.400
 it's not an adrenaline thing that makes the legs jump it's serotonin yeah

00:48:10.400 --> 00:48:16.360
 having to do with what sorry all of the inflammatory stress things tend to go

00:48:16.360 --> 00:48:21.400
 together. So would you recommend like aspirin for restless leg syndrome? Um

00:48:21.400 --> 00:48:30.360
 yeah pregnenolone aspirin and avoiding irritating foods especially legumes and

00:48:30.360 --> 00:48:37.040
 raw green salads those are very irritating. Those are things that increase

00:48:37.040 --> 00:48:46.200
 the bowel production of serotonin? Yeah. Beans and raw vegetables? That's

00:48:46.200 --> 00:48:49.800
 interesting because we just switched to trying to eat better and we had gone to

00:48:49.800 --> 00:48:54.720
 eating a lot more both of those. Have you noticed your restless leg syndrome?

00:48:54.720 --> 00:49:02.400
 It's a female it's my partner. Okay. And it's becoming very extreme and that

00:49:02.400 --> 00:49:08.920
 may very well be just from the diet. She was has a vitamin D

00:49:08.920 --> 00:49:16.400
 deficiency. She's told to take vitamin D and magnesium. Yeah. Do you know what

00:49:16.400 --> 00:49:20.880
 her vitamin D level was and how much she's taking? I don't know exactly

00:49:20.880 --> 00:49:26.560
 in measurement but it was very low. Right. Well the most most drop forms of

00:49:26.560 --> 00:49:31.640
 vitamin D now that 2,000 IU a drop and if she has low vitamin D it's probably

00:49:31.640 --> 00:49:36.800
 below 20 maybe right around 20 which is very low and they've raised the

00:49:36.800 --> 00:49:42.960
 reference limit for vitamin D now up to about 45 so you supplementing with a

00:49:42.960 --> 00:49:48.880
 2,000 IU per day drop product she should be really loading up with six to

00:49:48.880 --> 00:49:54.360
 eight drops a day for about four or five days and then getting 4,000 to 6,000 IU

00:49:54.360 --> 00:50:00.360
 and then re-measuring her vitamin D. After about two months. Yeah. Okay so

00:50:00.360 --> 00:50:05.320
 Dr. Peat said that bowel irritation, inflammation will increase serotonin

00:50:05.320 --> 00:50:08.440
 production and that serotonin production with nitric oxide which we're going to

00:50:08.440 --> 00:50:12.400
 got a question for Dr. Peat about nitric oxide both those two compounds there can

00:50:12.400 --> 00:50:17.900
 be predisposed predisposing someone to restless leg syndrome. Anyway

00:50:17.900 --> 00:50:23.120
 thanks for your call. So Dr. Peat I saw today just in fact I was thinking about

00:50:23.120 --> 00:50:26.880
 it myself. I started looking at a couple of websites that do blood

00:50:26.880 --> 00:50:30.640
 testing etc and I couldn't see any nitric oxide blood testing tests done

00:50:30.640 --> 00:50:38.160
 but I did see salivary tests for those salivary nitrite strips to assess the

00:50:38.160 --> 00:50:43.520
 potential nitric oxide production in the body. I know it will be formed from

00:50:43.520 --> 00:50:49.320
 nitrite or nitrate and this site actually was this the funny thing is

00:50:49.320 --> 00:50:53.480
 this site was actually letting you know how you could increase your nitric oxide

00:50:53.480 --> 00:50:56.840
 more now you've been eating various foods which I wanted to question about

00:50:56.840 --> 00:51:00.060
 also because I know some of the Greens here that were promoting the nitric

00:51:00.060 --> 00:51:04.080
 oxide production with things that we actually are promoting as being

00:51:04.080 --> 00:51:08.120
 beneficial but there's obviously a reason for that now. So how do you feel

00:51:08.120 --> 00:51:13.600
 about testing your salivary nitrate nitrite level and how predictive or

00:51:13.600 --> 00:51:18.600
 preemptive that would be of nitric oxide production systemically? A recent

00:51:18.600 --> 00:51:24.080
 article just a couple of weeks ago came out suggesting measuring the nitric

00:51:24.080 --> 00:51:29.560
 oxide or its products in the body as a way of diagnosing hypothyroidism because

00:51:29.560 --> 00:51:35.560
 they're so closely connected but I would guess that the urine might be better

00:51:35.560 --> 00:51:41.640
 than the saliva because for other hormone testing for example just

00:51:41.640 --> 00:51:46.680
 thinking of food or being anxious or whatever can really change the

00:51:46.680 --> 00:51:51.020
 composition of your saliva. Right okay so you think that because that changes so

00:51:51.020 --> 00:51:55.040
 quickly then you're saying it's a not probably more relative to test something

00:51:55.040 --> 00:51:59.720
 that's there and it's stored and probably more representative of a

00:51:59.720 --> 00:52:06.840
 couple of hours of physiology? Yeah I think that the urine will give you a

00:52:06.840 --> 00:52:12.120
 good picture of your level of stress. You wouldn't want to test that after eating

00:52:12.120 --> 00:52:15.040
 spinach either with your saliva. Here's the other thing that was my other

00:52:15.040 --> 00:52:19.560
 question is even this website was touting nitric oxide as being beneficial

00:52:19.560 --> 00:52:23.560
 and actually spinach was a very good producer of nitrite and how that

00:52:23.560 --> 00:52:27.400
 was spinach would increase your nitric oxide and and they were touting

00:52:27.400 --> 00:52:32.600
 that. I know and I just want to ask you just to be realistic here and be real

00:52:32.600 --> 00:52:38.320
 for folks I know we mentioned greens purporting greens and boiled greens and

00:52:38.320 --> 00:52:43.000
 drinking the juice is very beneficial I know that you do say that kale can have

00:52:43.000 --> 00:52:47.360
 a thyroid suppressive effect so not to use much kale but spinach I think has

00:52:47.360 --> 00:52:52.400
 been one of those greens that has been portrayed as being relatively healthy so

00:52:52.400 --> 00:52:56.480
 what do you what do you think about spinach? If they're organically grown

00:52:56.480 --> 00:53:03.280
 without intense nitrate fertilization and if it's well cooked I think

00:53:03.280 --> 00:53:07.120
 spinach is good food. Okay we do have two more callers I don't know if we're

00:53:07.120 --> 00:53:11.000
 going to get them in they just appeared on the dial so let's say this next

00:53:11.000 --> 00:53:14.720
 caller. Caller where are you from? Hello? Yeah you're on the air where are you from?

00:53:14.720 --> 00:53:18.920
 Yeah I'm from Shelter Cove. Shelter Cove hi what's your question? My question

00:53:18.920 --> 00:53:25.920
 is for my daughter actually she wants to take testosterone and I'm wondering what

00:53:25.920 --> 00:53:30.240
 his take on it is if he has any experience with that how she can keep

00:53:30.240 --> 00:53:34.160
 herself healthy. How old is she and what's the what's the indication for

00:53:34.160 --> 00:53:39.280
 taking the testosterone? Well she's transgender she wants to be more male

00:53:39.280 --> 00:53:48.000
 and she is 16. 16 okay and I did you catch what the symptom was? She's

00:53:48.000 --> 00:53:53.000
 transgender. Okay transgender I didn't really hear that properly. Dr. Peat?

00:53:53.000 --> 00:54:01.000
 Wanting to masculinize? Yes. I think that's safe but it should be backed up

00:54:01.000 --> 00:54:08.680
 with pregnenolone and some progesterone to keep things in balance because the

00:54:08.680 --> 00:54:19.360
 tendency is if you're under stress of any sort for the testosterone to turn to

00:54:19.360 --> 00:54:26.720
 estrogen and the pregnenolone and progesterone will limit that conversion.

00:54:26.720 --> 00:54:34.200
 Okay. If you have access to either those both of those can be can be

00:54:34.200 --> 00:54:40.000
 obtained so progesterone and pregnenolone typically for a female

00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:43.360
 anyway they would normally be producing them and I don't know exactly the

00:54:43.360 --> 00:54:47.080
 details of the case and how the transgender nature of this subject is

00:54:47.080 --> 00:54:53.400
 either affected adversely or positively so in terms of their exposure to their

00:54:53.400 --> 00:54:57.760
 own natural progesterone being female and and or supplementing with

00:54:57.760 --> 00:55:02.080
 pregnenolone then that will offset the potentially negative effects that may

00:55:02.080 --> 00:55:05.280
 occur with using testosterone in a female. Because it could convert to

00:55:05.280 --> 00:55:09.920
 estrogen and become dangerously out of balance. And watching thyroid function.

00:55:09.920 --> 00:55:14.400
 Uh-huh okay. All right well thanks for your call we better take this next question. Thank you for your help.

00:55:14.400 --> 00:55:18.280
 You're welcome. Okay so caller we've got about three minutes if you can get your

00:55:18.280 --> 00:55:21.280
 question out to the doctor here and do it in three minutes and get a response

00:55:21.280 --> 00:55:28.880
 we'll wrap the show up. Where are you from? Are they there? Hey caller you on the air?

00:55:28.880 --> 00:55:32.600
 All right we had the second call Dr. Peat but never mind because we've only got

00:55:32.600 --> 00:55:39.560
 five minutes left so okay. All right I don't even know if we've got time to

00:55:39.560 --> 00:55:43.480
 perhaps ask another ask another question without running out of time but I'll

00:55:43.480 --> 00:55:48.400
 try here and I think we'll definitely open this up again next month if

00:55:48.400 --> 00:55:51.360
 you are available because I've hardly got any questions asked here because

00:55:51.360 --> 00:55:55.560
 we've had so many callers and that's a good thing. I wanted to ask you again and

00:55:55.560 --> 00:56:00.760
 with them I guess again we get the female issue in estrogen and inflammation

00:56:00.760 --> 00:56:09.440
 and cancers etc are pretty obvious as definite definite realities here. In

00:56:09.440 --> 00:56:14.840
 terms of the effect of iodide uptake by thyroid cells and the inhibitory effects

00:56:14.840 --> 00:56:19.240
 that estrogen has on that in a female again would you be typically just

00:56:19.240 --> 00:56:23.800
 wanting to lower estrogenic burden by offsetting that with progesterone and

00:56:23.800 --> 00:56:30.480
 pregnenolone and/or thyroid? Yeah thyroid and good adequate nutrition all the

00:56:30.480 --> 00:56:39.160
 vitamins and minerals are involved in controlling keeping estrogen under the

00:56:39.160 --> 00:56:48.600
 safe safe limit and the when you inhibit the formation of thyroid hormone either

00:56:48.600 --> 00:56:56.080
 with an iodine deficiency or an estrogen excess the thyroid stimulating hormone

00:56:56.080 --> 00:57:04.360
 fails to make the thyroxine and T3 and so it keeps stimulating not only the

00:57:04.360 --> 00:57:12.160
 thyroid gland making it grow and get bigger or nod nodules to form but it has

00:57:12.160 --> 00:57:17.960
 a related effect on every tissue to some extent especially the ovaries

00:57:17.960 --> 00:57:26.040
 polycystic ovarian syndrome is associated with low thyroid and

00:57:26.040 --> 00:57:34.600
 especially high TSH. TSH drives inflammation so that the so-called

00:57:34.600 --> 00:57:41.640
 autoimmune conditions associated with high estrogen women are far more

00:57:41.640 --> 00:57:49.880
 susceptible to all types of autoimmune diseases than males and that's largely

00:57:49.880 --> 00:57:58.360
 because of the high TSH exposure driving things like tumor necrosis factor and

00:57:58.360 --> 00:58:05.280
 the various cytokines and interleukins and prostaglandins that are activated.

00:58:05.280 --> 00:58:09.240
 Excellent I don't want to cut you short Dr. Peat and I really appreciate your

00:58:09.240 --> 00:58:13.400
 your knowledge as do I know all the people that have tuned in and taken the

00:58:13.400 --> 00:58:18.760
 time to listen and call from all over so a really really good show from all over

00:58:18.760 --> 00:58:22.560
 the country I appreciate people calling. Dr. Peat's website let me just sign off

00:58:22.560 --> 00:58:26.080
 giving out your information Dr. Peat so people can find out more. Unless there

00:58:26.080 --> 00:58:30.960
 was any last words you wanted to say Dr. Peat. Okay thank you. Thanks so much.

00:58:30.960 --> 00:58:39.080
 Okay so Dr. Peat has a pretty extensive referenced library in some ways

00:58:39.080 --> 00:58:45.800
 of symptoms and diseases and the mainstream science is argued against

00:58:45.800 --> 00:58:52.600
 with real science so the objective science of non-profiteering

00:58:52.600 --> 00:58:57.320
 organizations is bought out so much of the details that you'll find there and

00:58:57.320 --> 00:59:02.120
 listed in the fully referenced sections that come with each article on thyroid

00:59:02.120 --> 00:59:08.240
 hormones, saturated fats, regular hormones, pregnenolone, estradiol, whether it's salt

00:59:08.240 --> 00:59:12.240
 or sugar or cholesterol any of the other articles that he's done is a whole range

00:59:12.240 --> 00:59:17.960
 of them fully referenced his website www.raypeat.com it's one minute to the

00:59:17.960 --> 00:59:22.680
 hour my name is Andrew. My name is Sarah Johanneson Murray. And we can be reached

00:59:22.680 --> 00:59:29.760
 at westernbotanicalmedicine.com or you can call an 800 number 1-888-WBM-ERB

00:59:29.760 --> 00:59:35.800
 925. Thanks for your time and again next month we'll bring out more questions for

00:59:35.800 --> 00:59:41.120
 the doctor and they'll be contrary to public and regular opinion which is

00:59:41.120 --> 00:59:43.640
 always a good thing to give you the alternative then you can make your mind

00:59:43.640 --> 00:59:46.880
 up. The facts are out there if you want to look for them. Okay good night. Thank

00:59:46.880 --> 00:59:49.280
 you for listening.

00:59:49.280 --> 00:59:58.360
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