[Questions] usability and standards

[tessus]

I'm sorry, if this is not the right place, but with so many different channels, I don't really know which one to use to voice questions and/or concerns.

I've tested the latest version (1.3.1.0) of the Contacts app and there are basic features missing, which makes it practically impossible to use the app in any useful manner.

• Let's say you enter a name like Helmut K. C. Tessarek. Where can I specify what the first name (middle name(s) or initials) and lastname is? Another example: Karl Heinz can be either a first name, or a first name and a middle name.
• How do I enter a birthday? If I use the format YYYY-MM-DD, the field is gone the next time the Contacts app is started.
• How can I enter a birthday without a year?
• How do I enter: organization, position, title?
• Under Settings, the share icon does nothing. You click it, nothing happens.

I know that this app has undergone changes in the past, but above items are basic functionality.

Another major problem, which caused a data loss, is the following:
I had birthdays without a year on my client (Android phone) and the sync procedure removed all birthdays without a year, because the contacts app considered these birthdays as bad and removed them.

I really don't understand why this is happening. There is a vcard standard after all.
e.g. in the vcard standard the string --0620 means June 20th, which is a date without a year. But the contacts app rejects it, when syncing and deletes the field altogether.

This is nothing personal and please understand that I ask an objective question (I have noticed that some developers react rather hostile when confronted with facts).
owncloud is several years old and in all this time, it was not possible to develop a functional contacts application?
This is a fair question, please don't answer with: you can always code it yourself.

[DeepDiver1975]

Thanks for your feedback.
Basically all your points are discussed in individual issues.

Why is the app in the current state: we are right in the middle of implementing it and some things are not yet finished. Plain simple.

I will later reference all issues.

[DeepDiver1975]

Let's say you enter a name like Helmut K. C. Tessarek. Where can I specify what the first name (middle name(s) or initials) and lastname is? Another example: Karl Heinz can be either a first name, or a first name and a middle name.

#265

How do I enter a birthday? If I use the format YYYY-MM-DD, the field is gone the next time the Contacts app is started.
How can I enter a birthday without a year?

#122

How do I enter: organization, position, title?

This is in the header - with exception of position
@jancborchardt

Under Settings, the share icon does nothing. You click it, nothing happens.

Worth a separate issue - works for me so we should analyse why this is broken for you.

[DeepDiver1975]

Another major problem, which caused a data loss, is the following:
I had birthdays without a year on my client (Android phone) and the sync procedure removed all birthdays without a year, because the contacts app considered these birthdays as bad and removed them.

this should not happen and has to be addresses -> new separate issue please

[jancborchardt]

@tessus For the Organization details: Title and Position seem to be used as the same on most all other contacts apps. Not sure what you mean by »Position« otherwise, and if »Title« doesn’t suffice, please give an example. :)

[jancborchardt]

@tessus but yeah as @DeepDiver1975 said – most of these are already addressed in issues, and generally for each problem there should be one issue open, not a grouped one.

[DarkSteve]

Hi Tessus. The reason the app feels so far behind even though ownCloud has been out for years, is because the app is only months old!

With the release of ownCloud 9, the calendar and contacts were moved into the OC core. This meant the existing (mature) apps stopped working. The current Contacts app is missing the functionality that you've pointed out because the app basically started again from scratch.

The devs have done a hell of a lot in a short period of time, but yeah, there's still a ways to go.

Patience, Grasshopper, patience ;-)

[tessus]

@DeepDiver1975 @jancborchardt there's no field other than the name in the header I can change:

Neither is there a field I can add via the drop down:

To answer @jancborchardt questions:

Title is for the academic title(s)
Position is for the current job role/title
Organization is for the current company/organization somebody works for

Some applications use the field title for the job role.

[tessus]

I believe that priorities should be assigned differently. I have the feeling that in this case people rather work on how to make the app look fancy and to improve the user experience, which in turn has unfortunately the opposite effect.

Instead, the first priority should be a solid base (backend) namely a contact data structure that adheres to the vCard/CalDAV standard. Users don't care how to enter data. At least not at first. They can live with dozens of fields (and even strange input formats), as long as storing the data and syncing it to a mobile device works perfectly.

The next priority is data presentation for input and output (transforming the input data to vCard data (internal representation) and vice versa).

After that people can add fancy javascript functionality to create a better user experience (e.g. one field for the name, when clicking next to it, this single field could transfom into several fields for firstname, middle names, lastname, title, ...).

I know, the above list is rather simplified, but I think you get the drift.

Yet again I want to underscore that it is not my intention to badmouth the product but to voice an objective (as far as possible) analysis of the current situation.

[DeepDiver1975]

@DeepDiver1975 @jancborchardt there's no field other than the name in the header I can change:

Which browser are you using?

[DeepDiver1975]

Title is for the academic title(s)

as far as I'm aware of the title is part of the N array

[jancborchardt]

@tessus let me keep it short: This is an open source project, and everyone worked very hard on it to get it into the current state. Just because you have different priorities doesn’t mean the app is not good. It just means that you probably should get involved and help – this app is open source after all!
We aim to develop both functionality and design alongside each other. Because good design can’t be bolted on afterwards – Design is how it works, not just how it looks. Because an app with lots of features but lacking UX is not fun to use at all. Because we’re doing this app for us.

Besides the screenshot you show above is outdated, the current version looks like this:

The »Title« (as in Dr, Prof etc) distinction will be part of the name splitting: #324

@DarkSteve thanks a lot for your kind words! :)

[DeepDiver1975]

to voice an objective (as far as possible) analysis of the current situation.

no need to do that - we all know ourselves where we stand 🙊

[tessus]

@DeepDiver1975 the screenshot I sent was with Calendar 1.3.1.0.
I'm using Firefox 47.0 on OSX 10.11.5 and 10.9.5.

Enabled:
  - activity: 2.2.1
  - calendar: 1.2.2
  - comments: 0.2
  - contacts: 1.3.1.0
  - dav: 0.1.5
  - federatedfilesharing: 0.1.0
  - federation: 0.0.4
  - files: 1.4.4
  - files_pdfviewer: true
  - files_sharing: 0.9.1
  - files_texteditor: 2.1
  - files_trashbin: 0.8.0
  - files_versions: 1.2.0
  - files_videoplayer: 0.9.8
  - firstrunwizard: true
  - gallery: 14.5.0
  - notifications: 0.2.3
  - provisioning_api: 0.4.1
  - systemtags: 0.2
  - templateeditor: true
  - updatenotification: 0.1.0
Disabled:
  - encryption
  - external
  - files_external
  - user_external
  - user_ldap

[tessus]

@jancborchardt

This is an open source project, and everyone worked very hard on it to get it into the current state.

I'm not denying this.

What I don't understand is that oc and its apps use object oriented architecture. Doesn't that mean that certain classes and methods can stay the same while the interfaces to the backend can easiliy be changed via adding another level to the class hierarchy or changing the existing abstraction layer class (which I hope was used in the first place)?

Just because you have different priorities doesn’t mean the app is not good.

These are not my priorities but the usual priorities of successful software design and development.

It just means that you probably should get involved and help – this app is open source after all!

I just did. I gave you a list of priorities. As I mentioned before, these are not my priorities, but a means to create SW the correct way. You can't build a car by putting 4 tires on the road and build the car around it.

I don't think I'm a good fit for this kind of coding.

BUT: Coding is not the only way to help a project. I can assign priorities and plan further development.
Sometimes developers can't see the forest for the trees. That's where I could help.

We aim to develop both functionality and design alongside each other. Because good design can’t be bolted on afterwards – Design is how it works, not just how it looks.

I agree to disagree. In a project like this (app, not core) there are usually at least 3 layers: backend, middleware, frontend. You can code the middleware with the frontend in mind. This doesn't mean you have to code them at the same time.
As a side note, "good design" is very subjective. People seem to think it is good design to be able to delete a user by just clicking on a little icon. If you miss the 15 seconds undo timeframe, all data is lost.
Personally I think this is idiotic. See, very subjective.

Because an app with lots of features but lacking UX is not fun to use at all. Because we’re doing this app for us.

I agree, but for UX to be successful, the underlying SW has to work.

Besides the screenshot you show above is outdated, the current version looks like this:

How can it be outdated, when I am using the latest version?